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Talk:Codex Arena

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Take that, PvX dickheads.--Darksyde 04:34, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

This article needs reformatting.
Interestingly, with the limited skill pool, it takes about 1-2 hours before everyone is running the same builds anyway Azaze Llo 11:55, October 23, 2009 (UTC)
Oh the irony RandomTime 12:00, October 23, 2009 (UTC)
I was quite excited about this for the first couple hours. Log on today and find that the days team build is already established, with some debate about whether the second midline should be e/me or condition ranger. Over it now. Definitely aimed more toward people who enjoy playing with set builds rather than those who enjoy creating effective ones. So far, the limited skill pool really reduces the viable options to about 4-6 builds, at least 2 of which are required in your team of 4. Not seeing a vast difference between this and HB tbh. Rather than a soft restriction on which builds are viable, determined by the shrine capping nature of HB, you simply have a hard restriction Azaze Llo 14:43, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

Seems like a nice way to undo all the other games and expansions, and slow down balancing. --98.213.157.175 12:19, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

Also, a nice way to pretend they are caring about GW players whilst working on GW2. If you're going to rush out a game which is essentially an advert for GW2 (eye) - at least let it have enough content to win us over until you eventually release the game RandomTime 12:23, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

Pfft, it's only the same builds if the morons don't touch their secondary, or don't think outside the box. This arena will reward creative people. I never saw anyone running the same thing as me. I'm hoping to get the title by the end of November, though. Glad5 can wait.--Darksyde 16:49, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

Oh and if you ask me they should add the old HB maps to the rotation for this. Like they did with RA awhile back. I think I was the only one who loved the HB maps in RA.--Darksyde 16:50, October 23, 2009 (UTC)
I was fine with the HB maps in RA, I just didn't like the extra things like shrines and NPC's that much. The terrain made for an interesting change of pace. Lazuli 22:01, October 23, 2009 (UTC)
I liked that for once we had something to do other than just beat our opponents into the ground, without settling for the douchebaggery of AB.--Darksyde 23:31, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

Skill set[edit source]

Is anyone trying to document the daily skill sets, maybe with an eye to establishing predictions and/or the exact extent of the pool? Or even just to know what opponents could be using? --◄mendel► 16:58, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

I've tried it out a bit, but I didn't really think of writing the skills down or anything. I do know that it's gonna be a pain for ele's to be able to puzzle decent builds (you'll always need to go hybrid).--TalkpageEl_Nazgir 17:31, October 23, 2009 (UTC)
As it well SHOULD be. But they made the various lines too damn powerful for you to actually need to hybrid (MS + water snare?) --Gimmethegepgun 17:33, October 23, 2009 (UTC)
It would be nice to have a daily list of available skills from all classes in one place, so that there won't be a need to switch/create new characters just to see the various skills which are available, especially the elites76.11.116.176 19:06, October 23, 2009 (UTC)
That's what I meant. --◄mendel► 19:43, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

Rofl, I already love this: Order of Undeath+Feast for the Dead and not a single minion skill... RoseOfKali RoseOfKaliSIG.png 19:29, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

Wow... Add Dark Bond to that. >_< RoseOfKali RoseOfKaliSIG.png 19:45, October 23, 2009 (UTC)
And Healer's Boon and NO non elite healing spells for monk. And pretty much the best way to win yesterday was to spam meteor and shame as much as possible.--Ikimono "...And my axe!"Monk-Paragon-icon.png 02:00, October 24, 2009 (UTC)
I'm just waiting for the day when Healing Prayers has nothing but Vigorus Spirit, Live Vicariously, Mending, Restful Breeze, Healing Hands, and Supportive Spirit. And nothing else.--Ikimono "...And my axe!"Monk-Paragon-icon.png 02:04, October 24, 2009 (UTC)
Today Necs got Dark Bond, Order of Undeath, and Feast for the Dead without a single minion spell.(Derp, just noticed that Kali pointed this out already) Which has also pretty much confirmed my theory that this is entirely random, and any attempt to "predict" or find a pattern will fail. I don't know why anyone thought Anet would take the time to pick 150 skills every day.--Darksyde 02:27, October 24, 2009 (UTC)
I'm not expecting a daily selection, but I AM expecting some algorithms to prevent this bullshit. RoseOfKali RoseOfKaliSIG.png 10:51, October 25, 2009 (UTC)
My prediction for tomorrow: Gash without Sever Artery, Barbarous Slice, or Crippling Slash. Day after that? All the axe skills except the ones that cause DW --Gimmethegepgun 17:51, October 25, 2009 (UTC)

Kicked out of a Group[edit source]

Okay, so I decided to try this out, and join a random group. I am an elementalist, and I was looking at all the different skills for today. I came up with an interesting lightning/necro build that I thought was viable. Some guy was looking for an elementalist who had a G5 rank, and I have no idea what that meant at all, but as soon as I pinged my HP bar, he called me a noob and kicked me out of the group. I told him off and was furious. Now seriously... I don't PvP much at all, but I wanted to try the CA out just once for fun. This just ruined my fun of PvP... I'm a level 4 max title elementalist, but I don't have any PvP titles at all. I don't like it how people judge books by their cover. You are supposed to work with the people that you have, not against them. I never had this kind of trouble in Alliance Battles, Random Arenas or Jade Quarry. But, I honestly think that the Codex Arena should be made exactly like Random Arenas, where people cannot choose who they are with, and then it would make it so that even the veterans of PvP would have to work with inexperienced players on both sides. Feel free to argue with me. 68.111.198.244 08:30, October 27, 2009 (UTC)

Well, you got a big point in the fact that people say "ZomG, no glad rank! noob!". I'm an occasional PvPer, not too bad at it, but I simply don't do it enough to get any titles... So far I haven't seen anyone do that, so guess you just got some bad luck with that guy. Also, the randomness might be a good idea, but RA already exists for that I'm afraid.--TalkpageEl_Nazgir 08:39, October 27, 2009 (UTC)
People who zealously ask for high Granks, or any other ranks in PvP or PvE for that matter, just think they're better than anyone, and love calling everyone noobs left and right, while themselves have zero social skills. I usually just ignore them. They always make me think of the fat guy eating chips in the WoW edition of South Park. ^_^ Now excuse me while I go kill some more boars and stay out of the way of their royal asses. RoseOfKali RoseOfKaliSIG.png 11:20, October 27, 2009 (UTC)
Great that you all think that way, but it doesn't solve the 'problem' with CA. I also wanted to try out CA, but with just a "mere" Gladiator one (don't like RA that much). I waited for more then half an hour, asking for parties, being kicked out of 8 groups, just because I wasn't G3 or better. I know, find guildies or friends and you might have a change, but after 4 years, there are not that many left online anymore... So, thanks ANet for CA, sadly enough it is just another platform for PVP 'elitists'. I think the 'closed deck' format quite intriguing, and *the* answer to those boring "uber"builds *everyone* is using in RA or TA. But so far, couldn't get in a team... -- Merty sign.gif-- ( talk ) 12:19, October 27, 2009 (UTC)
Use your friends list or your guild. That's how I got into PvP. So stop bitching. 13:23, October 27, 2009 (UTC) The preceding unsigned comment was added by King Neoterikos (contribs) .
There's also the problem that eles are pretty much the worst class in CA. They're not even guaranteed to get an attunement. Let alone have enough skills in a single attribute to make an attunement useful. --Macros 14:48, October 27, 2009 (UTC)
PvPing with a bunch of PvE people won't get you into good groups. It isn't as easy as you say it is. --- VipermagiSig.JPG -- (contribs) (talk) 16:15, October 27, 2009 (UTC)
Yeah, stop complaining. This is pvp, not carebear pve servers. Ever remember in elementary school when you were always picked last for teams because you sucked? Yeah, it's sorta like that. The single biggest misconception in PvP is that people rank discriminate for fun, to boost their own egos, to uphold an elitist society within the game, whatever bullshit. It's not true. Well, some do. But usually it's because they want better players on their team. And when PvE players come into PvP and see all the "R3+" being thrown around, and they try to join a team and they ping their hard mode wammo tank bar and get kicked, they start qqing about rank discrimation and how it should be fair for everyone. Well, no, you just suck. Rank or Glad isn't just about how long you've been sitting in Heroes' Ascent or 4v4 arenas (well, now thanks to ANet, it sort of is), but the PvP playstyle, no matter how much you may believe it to be, is vastly different than the PvE playstyle (with the exception of gimmicks), and displayable rank/glad isn't very hard to get anyway. So when people look for lower tiers of rank or glad, they're generally looking for people who know half a shit about what they're doing in pvp. And if they're looking for higher tiers, they're a bit more serious. For some other people, playing at a higher level of competitiveness might be their definition of fun in PvP, and in that case, they're definitely not gonna let some fresh PvE'er into their team.
Any arena situation where you can form your own teams is bound to have more or less some level of elitism integrated into it. It's just how it is. Guild Wars PvP is very competitive, and if people are playing to win, they will filter who goes in their team, in order to have a fighting chance. If a team has a sub-par player, he or she is going to drag the team back, becoming a noticeable burden as opposed to an asset to the team. 4v4 arenas in particular are harsh; each and every single teammate is incredibly important and a single mistake can cost a team the game. Like I said before, Guild Wars PvP is very competitive, and if you don't like it, well, don't do it. That's just how it is. — Nova Neo-NovaSmall.jpg(contribs) 18:10, October 27, 2009 (UTC)

(Reset indent) First, I'm sorry that IP had a bad experience their first time out. Don't let that (or peep's comments here) stop you from trying again. Next, there seem to be three issues raised here: (1) how do casual PvPers get to play casually? (2) should something be done about elitism in PvP? (3) regardless of whether elitism is acceptable, is it unsportsmanlike to kick peeps while calling them n00bs?

  • Casual PvP: Clearly, if you play mostly PvE, your guild and friends might not be the best place to look, since they are also likely to be PvE. Consider meeting folks during holidays (Costume Brawl), temporarily moving to a PvP guild that encourages newer players, etc.
  • Elitism: this should be ok, shouldn't it? Even in PvE, folks don't want to PUG if they are going to fail the mish, so it's sensible to review builds, to consider whether peeps seem willing to follow the designated leader. And, as suggested above, it's even more important in competitive play that each player meets a minimum level of ability.
  • Calling people's names: I actually like it when peeps make personal attacks in PvP. Why? it lets me know immediately that I have no interest in playing with them. Besides, those who can, do; those who can't...well, they have plenty of time for extraneous activities.

  — Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 06:07, October 28, 2009 (UTC)

Remove the ability to display titles in PVP outposts[edit source]

Problem of elitism is solved. Just how they removed /roll so you cannot roll to cheat anymore, all you have to do to prevent the Gladiatior R3+ BS is remove the ability to display a title next to your name in PVP outposts. The preceding unsigned comment was added by 65.207.54.194 (contribs) .

If you want that, you'll have to make an official suggestion or contact one of the devs/CMs. --JonTheMon 14:06, October 27, 2009 (UTC)
I don't really care that much. I have absolutely no interest in CA, and I am jaded when it comes to well-known, long-term problems getting fixed. I'm just mentioning the obvious solution, if someone else really cares they'll go through the trouble of submitting it.
Then you'll just be even more limited to people who can /rank emote to show what they are, and then they'll have to disable rank emotes in PvP too, and then there's no point in PvP titles altogether... Nah, not happening. The main problem with this is that it's hard to get started before you get your first ranks to show. But like Nova said above, that's just how it is, it's the same thing in school sports. RoseOfKali RoseOfKaliSIG.png 01:36, October 28, 2009 (UTC)
They just have to remove the bastardization of Team arenas and put TA back in. Problem solved with the arenas. The best way to not have people be elitists is to watch high end GvG and see how the pros are playing. Get better, and stop complaining.--72.189.82.222 16:12, October 28, 2009 (UTC)
"Just fix every problem with every possible skill combination so TA is balanced, and put it back!" If they want to return to a somewhat balanced game, they'd have to start choosing skills to remove entirely.. And not stop at 15 skills, but take dozens upon dozens out. Too many different factors are too difficult to balance. --- VipermagiSig.JPG -- (contribs) (talk) 16:30, October 28, 2009 (UTC)

For normal people G1 alone is over 500 games... and they expect you to have either g3 or R9 (and good HA teams only accept people who already have rank, successfully walling out all the new potential fans)70.68.14.196 23:51, October 30, 2009 (UTC)

Oh Q fucking Q. Go get a bunch of stupid PvE Scrubs like yourself, and make a guild so you can all QQ together. And while you're QQing, maybe play some Codex and AB. And once other people notice your QQ, they'll QQ with you. Then you can QQ in HA and GvG. And when you keep getting stomped because you didn't notice when your monk had Diversion on WoH you'll get vent so you can all QQ out loud. And after all this you'll all have a couple decent PvP titles, then you'll QQ because you get a bunch of stupid PvE scrubs whinning because you won't let them join your guild : "WE NO LONGER {QQ}". 70.30.26.23 03:54, November 3, 2009 (UTC)
I really am not sure how to respond to this personal attack without resorting to a personal attack at this time. Damn I'm tired. Well, maybe uhh... "That statement was completely idiotic". It was aimed at the statement, you heard me! Even though everyone knows the statement was not the intended target, but had a magnetic field for the statement to protect me from a backlash. Zohnoes they're on to me! Damn you magnets, WORK! Stop looking at me. This rant was as stupid, idiotic, and pointless as the previous one, though more amusing. I win --Gimmethegepgun 10:07, November 3, 2009 (UTC)
Rofl! I do like that guild name. :P RoseOfKali RoseOfKaliSIG.png 11:50, November 3, 2009 (UTC)
"I really am not sure how to respond to this personal attack without resorting to a personal attack at this time." I'll do it. You, sir, the one talking about "PvE scrubs", need to shut the fuck up. Some people play this casually, and have every right to be pissed off at elitist douches like yourself. God fucking forbid some of us have real lives, and can't spend much time on GW.--Darksyde 23:38, November 7, 2009 (UTC)
"elitist douches like yourself" seems to be a personal attack to me :P My suggestion: "elitist douches that demand <yada yada>" --Gimmethegepgun 10:02, November 8, 2009 (UTC)
All the pvptitles are overrated in Codex, it's a very different sort of pvp. you can't compare it to HA or TA. But people with a high rank in gladiator/hero use it to get players who are more experienced, so they can win more, and they're totally right. IF you are good, you don't wanna lose because your fellow players were a noob. Now I don't have any ranks in those titles but don't cry about getting kicked out of teams. Just don't invite yourself in experienced teams at all. Remember when everybody farmed Norn points using ursan? I did it too, and there were people too who were looking for r8+ teams, because they wanted a fast SC with experienced players. Nothing personal. Fleshcrawler Soban 18:32, November 9, 2009 (UTC)
Codex arena is a joke, anyone who looks at it and takes it seriously needs to get slapped.--Ikimono "...And my axe!"Monk-Paragon-icon.png 00:09, November 12, 2009 (UTC)

Elitism belongs elsewhere either here or in real life[edit source]

You guys can feel free to argue with me if you want, but Elitism is a common problem in this arena, as I have seen myself. If you really want to get competitive, and do all that, that's why you have GvG and HA, but not this area. Have any of you ever started to work in the IT field in real life? Well, I'm currently looking for a job out there, and I'm faced with the same BS and having to deal with entry-level jobs such as help desks wanting 3 years experience or better. Let's face it though, while nobody wants a noob or someone who is a total moron, it's still rank or experience discrimination. Everyone had to have started somewhere right? Well, the inherent fact is, I haven't even played in Codex Arena yet at all, because of this BS that is happening right now, so without any way to prove skills other than randomly being in teams in RA and hoping for luck to be on my side, I'm pretty well screwed. Just as I cannot get into a job interview, besides that fact the economy is bad now, I just have no way of showing people how well of a good PC repair guy I am. So, I tell anyone who has posted here, whether you are a newbie or a 1337, there's no harm in helping someone who is new, and teaching them the ropes. Do something for the community, either here in GW, or IRL! I'm looking at volunteering at a computer shop so I can get a job in the IT field later, because the experience is invaluable. 74.11.114.65 04:38, November 13, 2009 (UTC)

I'm not a fan of elitism either, but the difference between taking an experienced player and taking a new player is often the difference between winning and losing, especially on a 4-man team where there's no one to pick up the slack. Felix Omni Signature.png 05:31, November 13, 2009 (UTC)
Why would I want to hire someone for my helpdesk with no experience answering phones when I can have someone who has done it for three years? Why would I want to include in my PUG a non-guildie who's skill bar requires 5 attributes? Why would 3 good PvPers want me to be on their Codex team when they can have someone who has won regularly in PvP? When I'm hiring, I'm definitely going to discriminate in favor of quality; past success is just about my only proxy for measuring that. There's appropriate time to give people a chance (in guilds, in training, in gym class teams); there are other times when it's working against everyone's self-interest...including the n00b's. (I can't tell you how many times I've seen someone fail at a job because the boss thought there was no harm in giving someone a chance.)
While I fully support those who choose to use rank as their proxy for choosing PUGs, I also think that too many peeps are unnecessarily vicious about how they go about it. It's simple (and quick) enough to type, sorry, we're looking for more experienced teammates; there's no reasonable excuse for insulting other players. (On the other hand, if you win against serious trash talkers, then you get special dispensation for signifying.)   — Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 07:50, November 13, 2009 (UTC)
I think what mr. IP's problem is is that a stupid title really doesn't mean ANYTHING when it comes to determining who's a noob or not. It may well show that they aren't a NEWB, since they clearly have experience, but experience doesn't mean anything if you suck. Since it will likely be necessary over the next few hours/days/however-long-this-conversation-takes, here's a guide as to the subject --Gimmethegepgun 13:54, November 13, 2009 (UTC)
I think there should be random teams in this arena, if it was we would get rid of those really long boring battles that I always end up in with 1 monk healer, 1 rit healer a war tank and a para >.< 83.254.187.88 21:31, November 17, 2009 (UTC)
Well, that's why there's RA. Unfortunately, as long as there are some skills that are clearly superior to others, these skills will create metas. RoseOfKali RoseOfKaliSIG.png 21:57, November 17, 2009 (UTC)

I think that the whole point of what he said is that we need to stop looking at ourselves as the best. No one is perfect, and everyone has to start somewhere now don't they? Now personally, I've dealt with guilds that have been good mentoring guilds, and other guilds that just don't want to have **** to do with you. Now which guild do I stay in? I'll let you answer that yourselves. My whole point is that no one likes an elitist jerk at all. Now, I'm not talking about people that are in PvP, PvE, but more of a general sense. Would you guys go out and get a job that pays $10/hour that requires 4 years of experience and has no benefits? Just think right there though... that's a red flag that the person you may be working for may belong to the group of elitist people, and only wants someone who is the best of the best and will work for dirt cheap. Of course, there will always be one person that will put up with it because they are desperate, but the whole point is that it doesn't need to be this way at all! No matter how hard the game of guild wars gets, I'm not joining any group or guild that contains anyone like this, and there's no way in hell that I'll ever work for someone who expects 4 years of experience and pays you 10 bucks an hour with no benefits at all; that's a clear indication of elitist bull ****.

You can't blame the players for the elitism problems in GW. It's A-nets fault. They reward those who put in the LEAST amount of effort and punish those who want to work for it. Since the release of EoTN they have changed thier fundamental game logic (which was why we loved Guild Wars in the first place) from being a game about skill and co-operation to being a game centered almost wholly in grind, where skill takes a backseat to meta and co-operation extends only insofar as the self-entitlement crowd can still feel better than the next person. The codex arena , depite its intentions, is really only further and more definitive proof that A-net has not only completely lost touch with thier playerbase, but that they no longer care much about them. I am sure there will be some nice things happening just before the release of GW2(for abvious reasons), but, in the end, Real Gamers are gonna see right through that. We know A-net abandoned us and gave the game away, and we aren't gonna forget it when GW2 comes out. GW2 will sell well, but the community will be so plagued by elitism that NOTHING will make them happy. A-net failed gamers , no question, but more than that they failed themselves. I hope they enjoy thier profits from GW2 when the time comes, whatever the sum..... they have sold thier souls for it. 75.142.136.4 18:03, April 12, 2010 (UTC)
Lolwut, sold their soulz? I have played this game for quite a while and I never felt like A-net abandoned me or anything, in fact I can feel their presence about anytime I log into the game. I don't know why you think Codex Arena is bad, but I like it. So I am just saying A-net did not "fail me as a gamer" in any way, no question. EM Signature.jpg ***EAGLEMUT*** TALK 21:16, April 12, 2010 (UTC)

Red link[edit source]

Can someone create a Sealed Deck page? I don't really know what it is :x 10:13, December 25, 2009 (UTC)

Created. Please comment on the implementation (both article-wise and in-game) on its discussion page.   — Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 00:37, December 26, 2009 (UTC)

I think[edit source]

We all would like to get this removed and get TA/HB back, cause this is garbage. Roxas XIII 15:36, February 3, 2010 (UTC)

Speak for yourself. RoseOfKali RoseOfKaliSIG.png 17:41, February 3, 2010 (UTC)
Codex Arena is actually thousand times better than both to be honest. In my opinion TA and HB were the worst PvP arenas in GW and I hope they will never return, ever.EM Signature.jpg ***EAGLEMUT*** TALK 18:33, February 3, 2010 (UTC)
Maybe, but atleast Anet could have spared HB and TA, what's the point of having the Commander title without it can get finished. People spend time earning their title, same like Gladiator. TA was a good alternative for those Glads and was a good way for the GW community to play as a team, now a random noob can earn random glads in Random Arena's which makes the title less attractive and makes it look bad. 83.128.97.199 23:35, February 5, 2010 (UTC)
1) The Commander title was not "earned", it was farmed. Most people got their title from Red Resign Day, and before that, /roll. 2) TA was more elitist than any other arena in the game. You know how people will only let you into HA groups if you're rank 3, or 6, or whatever? TA was worse. If you weren't one of the TA regulars (and trust me, all the regulars knew each other), then you might as well go to RA, as that was the only place you'd be able to get a glad point. --Macros 02:48, February 6, 2010 (UTC)
GvG, HA, and TA were the god-children of Guild Wars. Codex arena is the autistic kid that you have to live with because people told you you have to. /discussion.--Ikimono...And my Axe!Monk-Paragon-icon.png 01:36, April 9, 2010 (UTC)

The Answer[edit source]

Elitism in Guild Wars is just a micro-sized model of all of humanity. In actual life there are closed-circle groups of people and there are the insignificant people outside of these circles. The only solution is to destroy all humans. Aliceandsven 17:39, April 21, 2010 (UTC)

Finally someone has a point, I'm with you !!!! Let's destroy 'em all !!!11 Mwuahahahaah EM Signature.jpg ***EAGLEMUT*** TALK 15:10, April 22, 2010 (UTC)


Protector's Defense[edit source]

Um, why is it banned from Codex? 129.116.56.231 10:18, May 20, 2010 (UTC)

coz it's too awesome. EM Signature.jpg ***EAGLEMUT*** TALK 13:19, May 20, 2010 (UTC)

There should be divisions[edit source]

There's one solution I have to the problems that we've been having with PvP: Make Divisions. By this, I mean that there should be one area where battles are ranked, and another where they are not, and in the area that they are not, titles should not be able to be displayed (thus for fun), and thus if you party with a G0 rank, you get a bonus at random (but only one so people won't stack these), but with each G6 or higher, you get penalties for each one. They've done this in many different ways in Guild wars already, but that would definitely make things interesting.

Another alternative is that they could make like several districts permanent for each G Rank, with District one being the lowest rank, thus only G0's and G1's can enter it, but anyone can enter the higher districts as long as their rank does not exceed the district number. The higher district #'s could give you more rewards than the lower ones. Lower-ranked units in the higher districts could also give bonuses to higher ranks, making it an incentive for higher-ups to "Help a noob", and even more bonuses if the person is not in the same guild or alliance.

Another idea I have: One area of the Codex Arena could be the way it is now, and another area could be like a Random Skillset Area which people do not get to choose their skills at all, but are given a skill set at random for their class (7 Skills, 1 Elite Skill). This area should make it so that basically anyone could get a crap build or a good build, but it's all up to luck. Then, winning teams should have their skillsets randomized each time as well, that would make for a more interesting challenge, so that no one group will dominate over another. This arena should not display any titles, and also should require at least one of each class uniquely to join the party, with a maximum of 8 people per team. They could call this arena, the "Chaos Arena" or something like that, because it's all up to pure random luck and skill (how you play that luck) to win or not.

68.111.228.139 08:18, August 25, 2010 (UTC)

Woah that's some crazy ideas lol. The second one sounds like fun but I think there would be a lot of trouble with equipment if your skills are different each time. Maybe disable equip but that would be lol as well. EM Signature.jpg ***EAGLEMUT*** TALK 13:25, August 25, 2010 (UTC)