Talk:Visions of Regret

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wow backfire for warriors >_> --Chichiri 11:54, 23 September 2006 (CDT)

Awesome. Brutal. Glorious. Arshay Duskbrow 00:05, 24 September 2006 (CDT)

Brilliant! Seva 11:13, 25 September 2006 (CDT)

Cant agree more, great hex --FirstBornSon 07:22, 26 September 2006 (CDT)

Doesn't work on Ranger and Assasin... >.> Lightblade 20:31, 26 September 2006 (CDT)

mixed feelings on this... 102 damage may seem pretty good, but then they stop attacking and heal it back with 1 heal sig. I suppose it would work on noobs though that don't watch their hexes.

That's how it supposed to be. If this skill can deter Warriors/Paragons from using adrenal skills, it's served its purpose admirably. Arshay Duskbrow 01:40, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

2 second cast.. — Skuld 02:04, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

learn to play Mesmer --Kitty1.jpg (Talk) (Cont) (Cool) Soft2.jpg 02:06, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

Mind Wrack, Spirit Shackles, Empathy, and Visions of Regret together would be extreme nastiness. I'm glad this hex made it into Nightfall as it makes Domination a more well-rounded attribute line. --Ufelder 02:22, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

I second the notion. This is true warrior/paragon punishment.--Life Infusion 20:22, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
Yeah, Spirit Shackles plus this is indeed a nasty combo, drain all their energy so they have nothing to use but adrenal skills. :D -Entheos Geon Dervish-icon-small.png‎ 22:13, 21 November 2006 (CST)

Wikified the article a little. mikkel 11:11, 16 October 2006 (CDT)

Works nicely for tearing apart Paragons with that silly Go For the Eyes and Watch Yourself spam too. --Kit Engel 18:58, 15 November 2006 (CST)

That's a very nice point there.

Aquisition[edit source]

Does anyone know if this skill can be capped from the [1] ? I'd update the skill page, but need to know if it's confirmed.--Morning Storm 15:45, 27 October 2006 (CDT)

Alright, I want Visions of Regret as much as all of you, so trust me I tried capping it from the Evil Mime. He's not a boss like he was in the preview event any longer. The search continues for someone to cap it from. I would guess that it is a boss version of a Shadow Mesmer, since the Shadow Mesmers in the Realm of Torment are equipment with it. Seva 11:40, 3 November 2006 (CST)

:( -- Barrage.

Ouch[edit source]

"This skill is most effective when applied just before a Frenzy-based adrenaline spike." --from article

Whoever wrote that wasn't joking! I'd never even heard or seen this skill before, and I was just building up adrenaline hitting a mesmer when I must have been hexed with it. I unloaded my adrenaline spike and died in about 2 seconds. It all happened so fast, if it wasn't for the new icons down the left telling you what hurts you I wouldn't even know what killed me. Anyways I will watch out for it on adrenaline based characters, Backfire for warriors is right. :( --Carth 20:16, 7 November 2006 (CST)


Perfect[edit source]

Anyone realize hoew perfectly the name fits? lol! Baron Baron.JPG 22:10, 28 November 2006 (CST)

I was thinking that this looks like the perfect counter to those zergway (fear me) teams that keep destroying my unranked groups.--Coloneh RIPColoneh.png 13:23, 15 January 2007 (CST)

Visions of Regret covered with Ignorance. gg warriors and paragons. Van Wark 17:22, 25 February 2007 (CST)

I can't even use this skill anymore. It's too damn powerful. It's like backfire; there's no challenge, honor, or fun in seeing someone cast themselves to death in PvE or unorganized PvP (CM, AB) for the 6,500th time. Likewise, this "Empathy on steroids" is just too damn powerful to be fun. Which is sad, because it truly is a rush of giddy, stomping-your-sandcastle glee when you first cap this, but... it's just too powerful. (For the record, I make it a rule not to use Empathy either, except in certain very specific circumstances, like vs. Shiro). Mesmerdom is about finesse. This is HULK SMASH. Visions of Regret, you are too beautiful for this world. Zaq 14:42, 9 March 2007 (CST)

Someone got the idea that it can be capped off the Evil Mime..... again. I removed it. Seb2net 15:38, 9 March 2007 (CST)

If someone keeps on attacking through Empathy or casting spells through Backfire untill they die, they deserve it haha... Silver Sunlight 13:44, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

Abit late but no one here has said this:Use empathy, visions of regret AND insidious parasite! That would really hurt, especially if they used a adrenal attack skill. Flechette 04:07, 23 August 2007 (CDT)

Erm, well... yeah. That's obvious. You might as well add reckless haste and price of failure. Don't factor in absurd energy cost, cast time, and ability for the target to STOP attacking. --130.95.105.243 04:12, 23 August 2007 (CDT)
If it stops the enemy from attacking, it's done it job. You can attack, run and leave you/teamates/point vulerable or get attacked and die. Anyway, I was saying it as a "what if". In PvE it may be very good against bosses, those skills will do the job without any other skill used. Flechette 04:19, 23 August 2007 (CDT)

Why is this better than Soothing Images[edit source]

If this is used to keep your opponents from using adrenal skills, why not use Soothing Images and Mantra of Persistence. Damage can be dealt in much easier ways, such as Degen, of which the mesmer's got loads (this skill only damages newbs imo, any experienced player will make sure to not use adrenal skills, when low on health, and get it removed). I just don't see why this is a good elite, with skills like soothing images around. --Rickyvantof

Uhm, first of all, that's two skills on a bar, this is one. Second, this is a damaging skill, comparing it to shutdown is silly. Third, you can damage experienced players with it - some experienced players may chose to use one adrenaline skill through it anyway, or they may not see it when they're charging the enemy monk. --Phydeaux 11:00, 5 April 2007 (CDT)

It's also domination rather than illusion, if you really need another (possible) reason.—Aranth 01:09, 17 April 2007 (CDT)

Soothing Images is still better - if they were going to use adrenal skills through Visions of Regret, you've won already. Tycn 04:56, 24 April 2007 (CDT)

There's a reason mesmers have fast casting... Spells like Backfire can be used much more effectively if you cast it on someone you know will be casting a spell soon. This is the same, it's stupid to cast visions on a random warrior just walking towards you. Cast it when he has already gained adrenaline, chances are you will get at least one or two triggers for this hex and that's a lot of damage. Silver Sunlight SSunlight.jpg 10:49, 29 April 2007 (CDT)
Well there is the possibility of a bit of damage, but Soothing Images achieves the other side - shutdown. Anyhow, if you wanted to deal damage you could use Ineptitude and Clumsiness (still bad), and it'll work on more than just warriors and paragons. Tycn 02:30, 30 April 2007 (CDT)\
This isn't just a "bit" of damage :P it's alot even if it triggers only once...but still Soothing Iamges and this skill can't realy be compared since they both do something entirely different. Silver Sunlight SSunlight.jpg 08:00, 30 April 2007 (CDT)

The difference is that Soothing Images only prevents further adrenaline gains, whereas Visions of Regret (and Sympathetic Visage for that matter) can stop them from using a skill that is already charged. Also, from experience, Vision of Regret is totally evil on warriors using Rush as a cancel stance for Frenzy. --Theeth Assassin (talk) 09:50, 30 April 2007 (CDT)

I think think this skill is elite based on a pve standpoint rather than pvp. It has a lot of high damage/farming applications as monster AI isn't programed to stop using skills when under hexes such as this. For any serious pvp, I doubt I'll ever touch this skill as many other elites provide greater versatility or function. --Rururrur 10:39, 4 July 2007 (CDT)

Icon[edit source]

Why is that a necromancer in the icon? —SigmA Sigm@Oo.gif 14:10, 3 May 2007 (CDT)

Necros look cooler than mesmers, and elite icons should be cool? Lord of all tyria 14:11, 3 May 2007 (CDT)
Necros are oegly —SigmA Sigm@Oo.gif 14:13, 3 May 2007 (CDT)
Necroes are awesome! Thou shalt not hate upon a necromancer. --Skax459 16:08, 22 May 2007 (CDT)
Looks more like a Mesmer behind a mask. Luigi 23:47, 27 May 2007 (CDT)
Whoever it is, definetly a bit of an emo '_W Leeroythefeared 07:34, 19 June 2007 (CDT)

What if...[edit source]

There was a Spirit that made ALL skills cost 1 more Adrenaline (and if they didn't cost any, they would cost 1)? Closest thing we have is Infuriating Heat, and come to think of it, IH may encourage use of Adrenaline... Just plop this hex on right before the use XD 64.12.116.198 01:00, 5 July 2007 (CDT) (ARGH FORGOT TO SIGN IN AGAIN. It's LavaEdge324)

This skill fucking sucks. — Rapta Rapta Icon1.gif (talk|contribs) 21:51, 7 July 2007 (CDT)
What!? Are you a warrior that just got on the wrong end of it? ;D Leeroythefeared 19:31, 9 July 2007 (CDT)

Damage[edit source]

Is it just me or is the damage taken affected by armour? Whenever the Shadow Mesmers in the Realm of Torment put this on me the skill description says I'll take 120 damage, however I've been taking between 70 and 80 damage. The only time I took 120 damage was when I used Healing Signet! Russell Willis 10:08, 19 July 2007 (CDT)

Healing Signet isn't an adrenal skill. Obviously there's something wrong here; are you sure you're using adrenal skills? GDSig.JPG 10:43, 19 July 2007 (CDT)

Needs a buff[edit source]

Well? 20 sec recharge is a bit long, soothing images would be a better choice if your were gonna do adrenaline denial, and its only effective against paragons and warriors. Maybe make this like the "Spoil Victor" for mesmers? like make it trigger when they cast an offensive spell or ect...make recharge time 10. (69.237.40.207 00:49, 21 July 2007 (CDT))

good joke lol needs a buff lolVorrax 00:08, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

I think what alot of people don't get about this skill is that it is NOT adrenaline denial. Think of it as more of an adrenaline punishment skill. The mesmer's job isn't always support...

Yeah adrenalin denial isnt the point, thw hole point is damge and against idiots hell this does it well.

It's basically elite empathy with double the dmg but doesn't work all the time. Pretty crappy. 76.186.15.83 18:28, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
Depends. In a PvE zone with plenty of dumb AI warriors who use adrenal skills, this can be pretty nasty (use Infuriating Heat as well to double your damage output).
That doesn't double damage output Blue.rellik 07:32, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

Double adrenaline=monsters using adren skills twice as often=double damage from this skill The preceding unsigned comment was added by 206.212.235.37 (contribs) .

That ain't cool.[edit source]

Can someone show me where we can find a warrior elite that could kick a mesmer's behind? Isaac The Dark 05:26, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Eviscerate. Visions of Regret only hurts if you let it. Buzzer 05:49, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
You never watch out for this skill tho, used nearly 4 skills once before I saw what I killed myself with...--AlariSig.jpg 05:52, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
Eh, it's a rock paper scissor game. Mr IP 06:59, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
Surely any decent warrior is capable of watching his hexes :S As for warrior elites that own mesmers...any standard warrior build should own a mesmer considering mesmers are an anti-caster proffesion and therefore have little defense against the martial classes. Try Crippling Slash, Eviscerate, Devastating Hammer to name one mesmer owning elite for each warrior weapon--Cobalt | Talk 16:36, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
Don't you find it ironic to call adrenaline attacks "owning" on the talk page of a skill that owns adrenaline attacks? So no, any standard warrior build will not necessarily own a mesmer considering mesmers are an anti-"whatever their build is intended for" profession. So quite the contrary, for any warrior build a mesmer build is easily conceivable that will own it. Fortunately, GW is a team-based game. A.Saturnus 10:03, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

update[edit source]

Please tell me there was a typo and ANet meant "uses an adrenal skill". Otherwise SS needs some love. Entropy Sig.jpg (T/C) 02:16, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

SS deals the majority of its damage on unskilled attacks, has twice the duration, and half the recharge. Felix Omni Signature.png 02:20, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
Lol...chain this with Backfire for super caster hate. - AdVictoriam1.PNGAd Victoriam 03:56, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
See Wastrel's Worry. Entropy Sig.jpg (T/C) 04:22, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
they may have changed these to be actually useful... but im really gonna miss killing a warrior when hit hits 4 times ( coupled with empathy) Roland Cyerni 04:24, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
good update, retooled a bunch of underused (useless) skills.24.47.18.113 21:11, 9 August 2008 (UTC)
I think I like this skill. It may make mesmers loved in PvE the way SS necroes are loved in PvE. Although SS is probably still better in most cases, this will deal a lot of damage, especially if they stop clumping up. For PvP I doubt that this will get some love though. Although it's finally an elite Backfire, Spoil Victor will very likely stay it's superior (and that's hardly used) 62.194.247.7 22:44, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
The range needs to be improved a bit because it doesn't have the advantage of triggering off of EVERYthing the foe does like SS. The damage should probably be toned down to compensate. If it was at like 50-60 at dom 14 and had at least nearby range it would be much better. Powersurge360 22:55, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
It does trigger on EVERYthing, the description says "whenever the foe uses a SKILL" and it's a much more viable elite than it was. Big Bow 08:06, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
It triggers on everything minus attacks. It is much more viable, but you can usually only get a mob or two, and most monsters don't constantly spam skills (only ones that do that come to mind are the Elementals). Therefore you get a smack or two out of the skill, then wait 20 seconds for the next cast. Now if you were to nail an assassin... Powersurge360 08:09, 11 August 2008 (UTC)

Spoil Victor[edit source]

Should it be added? Powersurge360Violencia 05:42, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Screw it, I'm copy/pasting the list from Spoil Victor, I feel they are all closely related enough. I won't add this to those articles though, in case people disagree, they only need to undo one edit. Powersurge360Violencia 05:51, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
go for it, this update is obscene
Tell me about it. One second cast, and it's useful in PvE or PvP. Great to cover backfire or empathy with, it adds a huge spike on spells or attack skills (250 damage to use a simple 'remove hex' with both backfire and this, and backfire's still there!), and when spiking isn't all that important in PvE, just stack them and let the damage multiply. I just encountered the PD boss in Sunjiang District and found a stack, put this on them all, and saw several 100's and three 200's from Frenzy in the matter of two seconds. Absolutely ridiculous, but I'm not complaining :D Favorite elite ever? I think so.

24.98.184.190 20:10, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

Er, two second cast. I must have just gotten a lot of halves-casting boosts.Aradon Triten 20:27, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
Or Fast Casting@14, which equals HCT if memory serves me right (for once :< ). --- Ohaider!-- (s)talkpage 09:52, 11 August 2008 (UTC)

overused?[edit source]

trust me, i LOVE this skill :) but every mesmer under the sun i see is using this. Being overused might make the nurf bat aroused and id cry if it got nurfed and possibly kill myself if it got altered like arcane conundrum. its the first time ive felt domination was usable in a while and i hope it stays that way.Pubis mcfly 01:37, 16 August 2008 (UTC) pubis mcfly

You mean all those Mesmers ya see crowding up farming locs and Missions, advertising 2k Mission+Bonus Pro runs as often as Warriors and Dervishes, right?... Ya I'm sick of seeing them all over the place too, I'm sure they'll aggro the nerf-bat in no time </sarcasm> ...but Seriously, I can't wait to cap this for my D/Mez and try it out on HM imps (gonna go do it right now infact) --ilrIlr d-small.png

I wish dmg cutted in half with Backfire and Empathy staking in the same line of magic this is too annoying. Big Bow 06:16, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

Overused, Spectral overpowered, nerf please Blah10

I don't know if you are talking about Spectral Agony or Spectral Vaettir, but neither of those is overpowered, and this isn't either. Entropy Sig.jpg (T/C) 13:53, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
Actually, it is in PvP. A Monk cannot do his/her job without getting butthurt to oblivion. And if it decides to not do his/her job, it's still dead meat. A Warrior could auto-attack for pressure. Unless the Mesmer has a brain. With the innate faster casting of a Mesmer, and the possiblity of reducing that even further, it's just so damn gay. In PvE it isn't as much a problem; Noone thinks about using it (fail) and barely any monster uses it in a good fashion, let alone combine it with WW properly. --- Ohaider!-- (s)talkpage 14:07, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
Most of my comments are PvE based. Also, Jotun Mindbreaker pwns joo. Entropy Sig.jpg (T/C) 14:15, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
I lol in the face of Hexes in terms of PvE'ing. --- Ohaider!-- (s)talkpage 14:18, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
Hench fail at removing hexes, and that would be a retarded bar to run anyway. H/H refuse to cast spells through Backfire or VoR, but will attack through Empathy. Entropy Sig.jpg (T/C) 14:21, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
...It's not a bar, lol. It's just some examples of hex removal/prevention ,of which most are common (Hexbreaker ain't, Convert isn't for PvE). Still, you can force your heroes to remove hexes. PvE isn't hard if you make it easy. --- Ohaider!-- (s)talkpage 14:24, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
Deny will remove 1 hex, Convert has too long cast time/energy cost, Smite has a slower recharge than Remove Hex (and you wouldn't run it without a smiter), Hexbreaker requires 8 Adren which you probably don't have ready as soon as the hexes are on, yes you can interrupt but H/H do not discriminate etc. And they usually come in pairs or more, maybe with a Jotun Bladeturner or some Jotun Skullsmasher for AoE KD...and they have a shitload of health. I've tried to use Hex Eater Signet but hench never clump as I'd like. Expel Hexes works OK if I can be arsed to take it instead of WoH/RC. Entropy Sig.jpg (T/C) 14:29, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
Depends on your bar (UA, Div Healing, Heaven's Delight = wincake Party Heal). Convert is something you put on your Eles or Mesmers (besides, one sec cast = just like any other hex removal). Smite Hex is for Smitesupports, deals damage n shit. You can make henches ball up with the flag :P Also, I disadvise using Expel on a Monk hero... Better just leave em WoH/RC and get a Para or something :P But, whatever floats the boat. --- Ohaider!-- (s)talkpage 17:30, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
I thought Convert had 2 sec, because I remembered White Mantle Abbot, but that is JI, nevermind. I only have myself and 3 Heroes in PvE, Viper, so my options are limited...Since Lina and Mhenlo are epic fail, I either take high damage output or strong defense, or I take two Monks to replace them. Running 3x/4x SH I don't have the spare energy for Convert. Mes in PvE is lulz unless they are also running VoR/Emp/Bfire :\ Heroes fail at UA and partyheals. I have not enough Para skills (nor the max eq) to make Para hero viable. H/H will ball up momentarily on flag but quickly scatter unless you're against all caster enemies...so Skullsmashers are trouble. (Expel on prot monk, as in EotN RC isn't always needed) Entropy Sig.jpg (T/C) 21:46, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

LoL?[edit source]

Wastrel's Worry as a cover hex? Sure if someone else is removing the hex, but usually the idea is to pressure the healers first. I think it should be removed, unless someone can convince me otherwise.--GerrOh! 07:10, 9 November 2008 (UTC)

The idea is that you hurt them either way.--Gigathrash sig G.jpgîğá†ħŕášħ 07:11, 9 November 2008 (UTC)
The article says as "both a cover hex and a guarantee that they will take damage either way". Damage either way i agree with(To some extent, there are certain circumstances), but WW is probably the worst hex to use as a cover hex, ever.--GerrOh! 07:21, 9 November 2008 (UTC)

so about that PvP meta[edit source]

In some ways I actually like it when skill like this becomes used by ~100% of the people, because it means I have a pretty good chance at being able to predict what to expect. This gives me a leg-up in the "Build Wars" of PvP. (not that I play srs bsns pvp, but you get the point) Entropy Sig.jpg (T/C) 16:13, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

Canceling the skill[edit source]

From the Wastrel's Worry page : "A foe hasn't officially "used" a skill if it is interrupted." So how do you avoid Wastrel's damage by canceling the skill? Silver Sunlight SSunlight.jpg (T/C) 11:26, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

Last time I checked, simply activating a skill doesn't end WW; it only goes away if a skill completes successfully, and then you'd take damage from VoR. But perhaps it's changed without noticing. Reed Stalkers outside of ToA would be a good place to test. Entropy Sig.jpg (T/C) 06:58, 26 January 2009 (UTC)


VoR vs SS[edit source]

so what will win? Vor with a duration of 10 seconds 10 mp 2 casting( even lower with fast casting) and loadsa damn damage,or SS with 8...18 15mp 2 casting 10 recharge and 29 dmg? VoR doesnt trigger attacks but empathy much. --BioSpark 12:43, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

They're both strong and brave, but VoR is much stronger in PvP because high damage is good pressure. 208.44.247.101 13:08, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
Yeah, SS is kind of ignorable in PvP unless (just like in PvE) you can throw it on a dumb melee with an IAS in a clump of foes, for example. It will stop someone after awhile especially if they have no self-heal, and it's also maintainable. But, I would keep attacking/casting through it unless I had a bunch of people near me, since it's not that much damage. In that case, it's just a matter of moving away from your allies first.
In PvP, VoR is dangerous under most any circumstance, especially if they also take Wastrel's Worry so you'll take damage regardless. It is also often stacked with Empathy and/or Backfire. In PvE, VoR is like Backfire... strong in the right circumstances, but in general unnecessary since things die too fast anyway. So it would be most useful on bosses, but in Prophecies at least, Natural Resistance makes it last just 5 seconds which is bleh. Meh. There aren't too many mobs that constantly spam skills like Flare, either, not that I've been able to find. Entropy Sig.jpg (T/C) 05:12, 27 March 2009 (UTC)

Beta Image?[edit source]

Mesmer-7.jpg

sorry about the size. Find these "sealed trading cards on the competitive section of their official website. Does anybody know where this image came from? Why it still isn't there? ~ JujipooJujinicon.jpgtalk 04:32, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
High-resolution_skill_icons/Mesmer#Visions_of_Regret --JonTheMon 15:41, 26 May 2009 (UTC)

Update[edit source]

I hope that wastrel's worry doesn't "end" before this damage is calculated. If it doesn't, then it's brilliant, if it does, it's moronic.--TalkpageEl_Nazgir 09:46, 19 June 2009 (UTC)

I don't quite understand what you mean, but to clarify- if you cast VoR and WW on someone, and they use a skill, WW will end prematurely and they will take the full damage from VoR. Which is fine, because that's how it is meant to be used. Felix Omni Signature.png 11:48, 19 June 2009 (UTC)
Hmm, yeah, I kinda realised my first statement was illogical. Anyway, this makes the VoR/WW combo much less powerful, so I hope the PvX-noobs will take something else now, it was practically the only thing you saw on a mesmer in low PvP...--TalkpageEl_Nazgir 14:05, 19 June 2009 (UTC)
Illogical, eh? I don't see how that's a problem. A F K sig 2.jpg A F K When Needed 14:07, 19 June 2009 (UTC)
It was the only thing you saw in Low end PvP because it was utterly retarded perfect for low end PvP.--Ikimono"a rabid grizzly bear"Monk-Paragon-icon.png 06:48, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
You saw it in high-end PvP, too. Entropy Entropy Sig 2.jpg (C) 07:00, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
I'm confused, does the damage trigger every time the target foe or adjacent foes attack or use a skill, or just when the target foe attacks or uses a skill? If its the first, it sounds like a godly version of SS! Piggyboy 12:48, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
The hex is applied to target and adjacent foes, meaning that each one of them takes damage upon use of a skill. Auto-attacking does not trigger VoR. It is a pretty godly skill, yeah. Felix Omni Signature.png 13:30, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
I remember a day when people needed to have skill to play a mesmer because they only had empathy and backfire as LOLPASSIVEIOVERHEXULUL skills, the rest was skillful interrupting. Then came Visions of Ridiculousness, sigh. It's still OP and overused. >_> --Takisig2.png 21:39, October 21, 2009 (UTC)